I feel the need to ask this very general question (with very variable answer) after constantly feeling under preassure to do scans in 20 mins. And being expected to reach this time for all patients and situations.
I am fully aware of the factors involved in the scanning time/patient (operator experience, patient cooperation and weight and shape, disease in question…etc).
However, what would it be a time for aiming as a target? For both abdominal and cardiac ultrasound exams.
I feel the need to ask this very general question (with very variable answer) after constantly feeling under preassure to do scans in 20 mins. And being expected to reach this time for all patients and situations.
I am fully aware of the factors involved in the scanning time/patient (operator experience, patient cooperation and weight and shape, disease in question…etc).
However, what would it be a time for aiming as a target? For both abdominal and cardiac ultrasound exams.
For what is worth, I am new in this forum, I will become a full member and I am planning to purchase the SDEP protocols asap.
But in the meantime, I would love some inputs on what it is considered a normal scanning time per patient.
I think the case load is an important factor, I am usually combining GP role with ultrasonographer in the practice. I usually have 2-4 cases for US per day, we do US only twice a week unless emergency US needed.
I have been doing abdominal US for 2 years, self taught (booked in for a 5 day pratical course in July, which I hope will help me improve in a few aspects).
I am very passionate about ultrasonography so I want to have a target for improvement.
Thanks very much for any input.
Silvana.
Comments
Typically a mobile
Typically a mobile sonographer should be done with a full abdomen or full echo within 15 minutes. In my circles that is usually where the value perception is of course this also depends on the complexity of the case but basically for your average cases this is a good rule to follow. Cats I think you can reduce that to 10 minutes. In general practice the times can increase however just also diminishes the value perception within the clinic. A doctor spending 30 minutes or more on a sonogram is not an economically viable scenario for the clinic. And of course it is important to get the optimal views and image adequately however it is also equally important to do so in an expedient fashion. This is exactly why I created SDEP program to combine expediency with optimal imaging
Typically a mobile
Typically a mobile sonographer should be done with a full abdomen or full echo within 15 minutes. In my circles that is usually where the value perception is of course this also depends on the complexity of the case but basically for your average cases this is a good rule to follow. Cats I think you can reduce that to 10 minutes. In general practice the times can increase however just also diminishes the value perception within the clinic. A doctor spending 30 minutes or more on a sonogram is not an economically viable scenario for the clinic. And of course it is important to get the optimal views and image adequately however it is also equally important to do so in an expedient fashion. This is exactly why I created SDEP program to combine expediency with optimal imaging
Torb-ace combination or Torbl
Torb-ace combination or Torbl IV can help and enhance the workflow very rapidly and allow for passive pressure to get into the common bile duct and pelvic urethra and adrenal gland that are typically the structures that take the most time to image.
Torb-ace combination or Torbl
Torb-ace combination or Torbl IV can help and enhance the workflow very rapidly and allow for passive pressure to get into the common bile duct and pelvic urethra and adrenal gland that are typically the structures that take the most time to image.
If interested on how I
If interested on how I address this issue with my sonographers/clientele I created the SDEP echo and ABD protodcols that you can download and self instruct with a computer +/- poster in front of you and patient under the probe. I will also be demoing this 2x a day in the SonoPath booth at ACVIM in INdy Thur and Friday June 4/5.
http://sonopath.com/products
If interested on how I
If interested on how I address this issue with my sonographers/clientele I created the SDEP echo and ABD protodcols that you can download and self instruct with a computer +/- poster in front of you and patient under the probe. I will also be demoing this 2x a day in the SonoPath booth at ACVIM in INdy Thur and Friday June 4/5.
http://sonopath.com/products
Thanks EL… Well, that’s
Thanks EL… Well, that’s very constructive. Like I said, I didn’t have any reference so I just needed somebody to give me guidelines.
Thanks again for your valuable help.
Thanks EL… Well, that’s
Thanks EL… Well, that’s very constructive. Like I said, I didn’t have any reference so I just needed somebody to give me guidelines.
Thanks again for your valuable help.
I am just learning how to do
I am just learning how to do the SDEP protocol. I am doing better but I still have some trouble with my imaging from the right side. I will keep plugging away.
I have also started submitting some selective cases to EL for a telemedicine consult. I am learning from his reports.
We all see the “big” stuff- but it is the subtle pathology that I sometimes miss.
I also find myself reviewing my study after the SDEP is done. I have picked up pathology and normal structures that I missed in real time ie R adrenal and Iliocecal colic region- where alot of pathology is found.
Price your ultrasounds to include a telemedicine consult- you won’t be sorry and it’s easy.
By the way- I don’t get a kickback 🙂
I am just learning how to do
I am just learning how to do the SDEP protocol. I am doing better but I still have some trouble with my imaging from the right side. I will keep plugging away.
I have also started submitting some selective cases to EL for a telemedicine consult. I am learning from his reports.
We all see the “big” stuff- but it is the subtle pathology that I sometimes miss.
I also find myself reviewing my study after the SDEP is done. I have picked up pathology and normal structures that I missed in real time ie R adrenal and Iliocecal colic region- where alot of pathology is found.
Price your ultrasounds to include a telemedicine consult- you won’t be sorry and it’s easy.
By the way- I don’t get a kickback 🙂
Thanks for your input. That
Thanks for your input. That helps. After EL answer I felt quite stressed. I’ll have to investigate all that. And also present it to my managers. It’s all about protocols. Thanks for your comment.
Thanks for your input. That
Thanks for your input. That helps. After EL answer I felt quite stressed. I’ll have to investigate all that. And also present it to my managers. It’s all about protocols. Thanks for your comment.
Thanks for your input. That
Thanks for your input. That helps. After EL answer I felt quite stressed. I’ll have to investigate all that. And also present it to my managers. It’s all about protocols. Thanks for your comment.
Thanks for your input. That
Thanks for your input. That helps. After EL answer I felt quite stressed. I’ll have to investigate all that. And also present it to my managers. It’s all about protocols. Thanks for your comment.
So, yes, I also spend a good
So, yes, I also spend a good while reviewing clips of the exams and I also pick up pathology after the live exam has been done. May I ask… What’s the time improvement in your case?
So, yes, I also spend a good
So, yes, I also spend a good while reviewing clips of the exams and I also pick up pathology after the live exam has been done. May I ask… What’s the time improvement in your case?
Thx for the compliments
Thx for the compliments Randy. Im glad you are finding utility in the telemed reads.. If you are having problem on the right side its usually because the patient isnt lifted up a bit to 45 degree right lateral and you arent pushing enough to push the RK against the body wall without any interfering organs between the body wall and the rk or cvc and right adrenal. Once you do that the right will be distal to the cvc at 3-4 cm even in a big fat Rotty. Or in last effort flip the patient to left recumbency and scan from the right in paralumbar or in the 11-13 rib space to get th erk an dright adrenal but i only go there in extreme cases…. its all about the passive push that lasts seconds til the adrenal passes through the video then save and scroll back.
Silvana no worries on the expediency its just self discipline and training to teach yourself to move faster through the landmarks and hand eye coordination and repitition… start at 30 minutes then push yourself to 25 then 20 then 15… its like training for a marathon… Its just trusting that it can be done wihtout losing image quality and actually enhancing it in less time. Come see us at ACVIM in the sonopath booth and I will be happy to show you. … though we are cheating and have a French Bulldog but that’s what my tech has … just happens to be an easy scan:)
Thx for the compliments
Thx for the compliments Randy. Im glad you are finding utility in the telemed reads.. If you are having problem on the right side its usually because the patient isnt lifted up a bit to 45 degree right lateral and you arent pushing enough to push the RK against the body wall without any interfering organs between the body wall and the rk or cvc and right adrenal. Once you do that the right will be distal to the cvc at 3-4 cm even in a big fat Rotty. Or in last effort flip the patient to left recumbency and scan from the right in paralumbar or in the 11-13 rib space to get th erk an dright adrenal but i only go there in extreme cases…. its all about the passive push that lasts seconds til the adrenal passes through the video then save and scroll back.
Silvana no worries on the expediency its just self discipline and training to teach yourself to move faster through the landmarks and hand eye coordination and repitition… start at 30 minutes then push yourself to 25 then 20 then 15… its like training for a marathon… Its just trusting that it can be done wihtout losing image quality and actually enhancing it in less time. Come see us at ACVIM in the sonopath booth and I will be happy to show you. … though we are cheating and have a French Bulldog but that’s what my tech has … just happens to be an easy scan:)
Thanks EL- I will try that
Thanks EL- I will try that
Thanks EL- I will try that
Thanks EL- I will try that
Thanks EL. I’d be only too
Thanks EL. I’d be only too pleased to visit you and learn loads but… I’m Adrain’s Asia is quite far away from wherever you guys are. So, may I ask, what is your time zone? It’s quite relevant in order to time my posts:)
I’ve had in 2 days such challenging cases that the right adrenal is now the least of my problems;) I now panic about PSS and unrecognizable stomachs and LNs and guinea pigs… Sigh… And congenital heart diseases! I have 1 interesting case to post. In the meantime, and until I can get the sedp package, another simple question: I usually do the majority of the exam on VD, is that wrong?i do some of the structures from R or L lateral recumbency but my anatomy changes so much that I can’t get my bearings. I basically do whatever I can in order to get whatever I need…( of course that’s why I’m slow;)…) anyway, thanks for all this input.
Thanks EL. I’d be only too
Thanks EL. I’d be only too pleased to visit you and learn loads but… I’m Adrain’s Asia is quite far away from wherever you guys are. So, may I ask, what is your time zone? It’s quite relevant in order to time my posts:)
I’ve had in 2 days such challenging cases that the right adrenal is now the least of my problems;) I now panic about PSS and unrecognizable stomachs and LNs and guinea pigs… Sigh… And congenital heart diseases! I have 1 interesting case to post. In the meantime, and until I can get the sedp package, another simple question: I usually do the majority of the exam on VD, is that wrong?i do some of the structures from R or L lateral recumbency but my anatomy changes so much that I can’t get my bearings. I basically do whatever I can in order to get whatever I need…( of course that’s why I’m slow;)…) anyway, thanks for all this input.